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[Bloodporne]

Asking him his opinion on social issues would be like asking Lil Wayne about quantum physics.

I'm in tears over this somehow...

 

[Gator86]

Embarrassing. Fucking embarrassing.

All that needs to be said. What a shithole.

 

[cmc`]

Honestly, I found this article a bit of a relief. Facebook isn't ignoring Luckey's actions, they're just not talking about it to the general public. Things are being done to correct the massive wave of Stupid that Luckey unleashed on them, but it's happening in-company and with developers. Facebook's public lack of communication is badly handled, sure, but actions like this don't happen if a large part of the company isn't taking things seriously.

Also, Facebook really needs to work on its PR.

If they were dealing with it internally, all they had to do was repeat a line every time they were asked, something like "We are dealing with it in house, we will make a statement in due course". Instead we got "LOL WUT?"

 

[NandoGip]

The article certainly tried to paint this picture. Actually jumping to such a conclusion based on no first-hand knowledge of the man is a harmful thing to do, and casting such aspersions on him because he is a "white programmer" is... Look, just please keep more of an open mind.

It's alarming to me how many folks here and elsewhere are only coming to stories about Oculus looking for reasons to hate everyone at the company. There are dozens of brilliant, wonderful people over there trying to solve difficult problems with products, services, and yes, internal culture. When you are only interested in these problems insofar as you can shit all over the people trying to solve them, then you may be amusing yourself, but do not pretend that you are helping anyone.

I'm not saying there is evidence that Carmack holds similar views to Luckey. All I'm saying is that from the little bit that I've read of his opinion on similar topics, it would not surprise me if he was a Trump supporter like Palmer.

I don't hate everyone at that company, I truly could care less. They don't even know I exist. I'm not here to help anyone either. My point was that as someone who is opposed to racism, I will not support a company who's founder tried to pretend he was some bootstraps self made billionaire, then tried to create a super pac for Donald Trump.

 

[staticneuron]

No I mean the fact they won't do anything is a statement.

Or it could be contractual. There are so many people here just spouting this stuff without thinking about a couple of things. The reasons for them not doing something could be legal. Most companies that have the power to do so, normally get rid of employees that make them look bad even if they apologize. Some CEO's have to mess up real bad and loss company money before they are kicked out (even with golden parachute) or simply cannot be removed for other reasons.

This is sad. Even if you don't like or agree with Palmer, it is illogical to take it out on entire company. The point of views held here are pretty heavy handed. People are free to hate whomever they want but I am simply not on the train to take down the entire company for the actions of palmer. I didn't buy a rift to support palmer, just the tech.

 

[ChrisMahoney]

Carmack is the definition of STEM thinking. He's very focused on the development of technology and has barely enough soft skills to communicate that focus. He's been known and even admits that he lacks empathy and connection to other human beings. He's borderline sociopathic in that sense.

Asking him his opinion on social issues would be like asking Lil Wayne about quantum physics.

You need to cite some examples before calling someone "borderline sociopathic."

 

[snickothemule]

The article takes the long road to explain hardcore PR management. Their strategic marketing team must have taken everyone aside and in typical fashion instructed them to make no mention of Palmer. Pretty standard fanfare for megacorp damage control.

I'm a bit disappointed the article didn't go into further detail about the more positive aspects of the luncheon.

And just about everyone gave a favorable review of the lunch, though some were confused as to why Luckey wasn’t mentioned at all.

Facebook: good luncheons. confusing PR management.

I'm not sure why Carmack is attracting ire, the dude is a tech bro whom is focused on his job, not a PR nightmare. It's not uncommon to have PR demand silence on topics that warrants a non response. Palmer must be too ingrained in the company legally to warrant a firing or public disciplinary action.

 

[Johndoey]

Does Oculus actually have a trained PR team? Because if they do those people need to get gone, cause what the hell is happening over there?

 

[R0ckman]

Why the hell would you beg someone to do something under no negotiations? Even a damn child understands that doesn't work.

 

[Brannon]

Something similar happened when I tried to ask Oculus CEO Brendan Iribe about Palmer. “I...I can’t,” Iribe told me. “I have to go find my mom, sorry.”

Aw man. Hope he doesn't have a twitter, because it's gonna get some grief over that. Because internet.

 

[Dyson Industries]

The article certainly tried to paint this picture. Actually jumping to such a conclusion based on no first-hand knowledge of the man is a harmful thing to do, and casting such aspersions on him because he is a "white programmer" is... Look, just please keep more of an open mind.

It's alarming to me how many folks here and elsewhere are only coming to stories about Oculus looking for reasons to hate everyone at the company. There are dozens of brilliant, wonderful people over there trying to solve difficult problems with products, services, and yes, internal culture. When you are only interested in these problems insofar as you can shit all over the people trying to solve them, then you may be amusing yourself, but do not pretend that you are helping anyone.

Sure, mate.

Except Oculus' leadership has no problem enabling one of their own who donates to racist, white nationalist organizations. That's massive, whether you like it or not - and you are deliberately choosing to ignore the numerous posts on this subject that go into detail on their concern for those brilliant, wonderful people

who may be African-American
who may be Asian
who may be Mexican
who may be LGBTQ

working at a company for a person who they now know without a shadow of a doubt holds them and their lives in contempt.
Under a corporate leadership group that is spineless at best, complicit at worst.

tl;dr - keep handwaving, you're not fooling anyone.

 

[WrenchNinja]

This is sad. Even if you don't like or agree with Palmer, it is illogical to take it out on entire company.

Not when people like Rubin and Iribe have decided to stand with him

 

[Seth Enosh]

Sure, mate.

Except Oculus' leadership has no problem enabling one of their own who donates to racist, white nationalist organizations. That's massive, whether you like it or not - and you are deliberately choosing to ignore the numerous posts on this subject that go into detail on their concern for those brilliant, wonderful people

who may be African-American
who may be Asian
who may be Mexican
who may be LGBTQ

working at a company for a person who they now know without a shadow of a doubt holds them and their lives in contempt.
Under a corporate leadership group that is spineless at best, complicit at worst.

tl;dr - keep handwaving, you're not fooling anyone.

They aren't "working for" Palmer. His role is "founder" and he's a kid, I doubt he's making hiring and firing decisions. They work for Iribe and for Clinton supporter Mark Zuckerberg.

Palmer is an idiot though many of the statements here about him are exaggerated. It's interesting how his single donation to Nimble America, a group who made one billboard attacking Hillary with a meme, becomes "donates to racist, white nationalist organizations" in the retelling. I noticed multiple posts in this topic suggesting Palmer donated to "groups". Unless anything new came out after the original articles and news story, that's simply not true (just the one $10k donation to Nimble and a failed attempt to solicit funds for them from thedonald users) but has been repeated so much people believe it.

I suspect oculus is just going to hunker down and hope people stop caring once Trump loses the election and the political season ends.

 

[Nzyme32]

This is sad. Even if you don't like or agree with Palmer, it is illogical to take it out on entire company. The point of views held here are pretty heavy handed. People are free to hate whomever they want but I am simply not on the train to take down the entire company for the actions of palmer. I didn't buy a rift to support palmer, just the tech.

We are talking about a corporate move to simply not even approach or accept the issues in favour of just upping their "diversity" programs and quietly taking people aside to try and get them back on board while still not publicly doing so, and the employees seemingly happy to play along. If people feel that is now representative of the company's approach to what is going on - yeah they can justifiably dislike the company.

 

[Shao Kahn Brewing a Stew]

Of course they want to pretend like it never happened. Winning the VR race is their top priority.

They won't.

 

[TheSaddestSort]

They've already missed the boat on this one, a "diversity luncheon" isn't going to obscure the fact that Luckey is a piece of racist garbage and that Facebook and Oculus will continue to support him.

 

[qa_engineer]

Ha.


*Puts HTC Vive back on*

Goodbye,real world.

 

[staticneuron]

Not when people like Rubin and Iribe have decided to stand with him

Again if this is contractual what can they say other than "they can't say anything?" Not saying anything doesn't mean agreeing or disagreeing. It simply means to not provide an outward stance. I work for a company in which I am not allowed to have a stance that would represent them. I understand if I were in the position that palmer was in I would be fired (I don't support his views nor trump at all) then again, i am not the founder of the company I work at. People do not have any real evidence about the deal struck with facebook, so it doesn't help to create a narrative that they are doing this because they side with him. How do you know if they simply cannot do anything about it?

We are talking about a corporate move to simply not even approach or accept the issues in favour of just upping their "diversity" programs and quietly taking people aside to try and get them back on board while still not publicly doing so, and the employees seemingly happy to play along. If people feel that is now representative of the company's approach to what is going on - yeah they can justifiably dislike the company.

Again, How do you know if they simply cannot do anything about it?

 

[Dyson Industries]

They aren't "working for" Palmer. His role is "founder" and he's a kid, I doubt he's making hiring and firing decisions. They work for Iribe and for Clinton supporter Mark Zuckerberg.

Palmer is an idiot though many of the statements here about him are exaggerated. It's interesting how his single donation to Nimble America, a group who made one billboard attacking Hillary with a meme, becomes "donates to racist, white nationalist organizations" in the retelling. I noticed multiple posts in this topic suggesting Palmer donated to "groups". Unless anything new came out after the original articles and news story, that's simply not true (just the one $10k donation to Nimble and a failed attempt to solicit funds for them from thedonald users) but has been repeated so much people believe it.

I suspect oculus is just going to hunker down and hope people stop caring once Trump loses the election and the political season ends.

He's 24 years old, well past the age of majority. Yet another example when adult white males are referred to as kids to minimize their wrongdoings, well done.

He was the major figure behind Oculus. He benefits financially from the work of their employees, both pre- and post-buyout.

Nimble America is cut whole cloth from Milo Yiannopoulos. You may know him from heavily promoting Gamergate, whipping up a racist mob against Leslie Jones for the crime of being black and in a movie, and other such nonsense. So either you didn't know all of this and are commenting on something you know nothing about, or you did know, and just don't care.

 

[JayEH]

Sad stuff

 

[NandoGip]

He's 24 years old, well past the age of majority. Yet another example when adult white males are referred to as kids to minimize their wrongdoings, well done.

He was the major figure behind Oculus. He benefits financially from the work of their employees, both pre- and post-buyout.

Nimble America is cut whole cloth from Milo Yiannopoulos. You may know him from heavily promoting Gamergate, whipping up a racist mob against Leslie Jones for the crime of being black and in a movie, and other such nonsense. So either you didn't know all of this and are commenting on something you know nothing about, or you did know, and just don't care.

QFT

 

[SmiteOfHand]

-Prosecuting him for being a Trump supporter and/or Libertarian.

-All companies are like this so don't even bother trying when this sort of thing goes public.

-There are good people at Oculus even though other prominent members have gone public supporting Luckey.

-He's just a boy!

Another round of this shit again? The guy has literally done nothing to deserve any benefit of doubt, or any reason for anyone to defend him or those who support him. And still, every thread, there will be people falling over themselves to do so.

 

[WrenchNinja]

Again if this is contractual what can they say other than "they can't say anything?" Not saying anything doesn't mean agreeing or disagreeing.

Have you seen what they've said? Silence would be one thing but this:

I want to respond to the recent press stories involving Palmer. I know that Palmer is deeply sorry for the impact this situation is having on the company, our partners and the industry.

Everyone at Oculus is free to support the issues or causes that matter to them, whether or not we agree with those views. It is important to remember that Palmer acted independently in a personal capacity, and was in no way representing the company.

And this

I wanted to give Palmer Freeman Luckey a chance to respond before I said anything, and having read his post, I take him at his word. Those of you who have known me before I joined Oculus know that I would not work in a place that I thought condoned, or spread hate. Nor would I remain silent if I saw it raise its head. I have always believed that games, and now especially VR, have the potential to bring people together. My view is unwavering. I continue to believe that Oculus can make the world a better place.

Is not nothing

 

[Seth Enosh]

He's 24 years old, well past the age of majority. Yet another example when adult white males are referred to as kids to minimize their wrongdoings, well done.

He was the major figure behind Oculus. He benefits financially from the work of their employees, both pre- and post-buyout.

Nimble America is cut whole cloth from Milo Yiannopoulos. You may know him from heavily promoting Gamergate, whipping up a racist mob against Leslie Jones for the crime of being black and in a movie, and other such nonsense. So either you didn't know all of this and are commenting on something you know nothing about, or you did know, and just don't care.

People in their early 20s are commonly referred to as kids. That's true regardless of whether you're a white or a male. Are you claiming that Palmer has a management position in oculus? I haven't seen evidence based statements for that, but I could be wrong. Feel free to link if you're right - my understanding is his title is "founder" and he's basically been sidelined since his habits of making exaggerated comments on Reddit related to oculus, not politics, had already made people mad.

I did know about Nimble, but I don't know how your response connects to mine. I said Nimble is one group and people in this topic are saying he gave money to multiple "groups". That's not what the original news stories said. What are the other groups you think he gave money to, and how much money do you think he gave?

Milo and breitbart media are scum, just like Trump. I think Trump is awful but I don't think anyone who supports Trump or his enablers needs to be fired. It's a wide net and we don't need to go there, Trump is about to receive the drubbing of his life at the ballot box.

 

[Seth Enosh]

-Prosecuting him for being a Trump supporter and/or Libertarian.

-All companies are like this so don't even bother trying when this sort of thing goes public.

-There are good people at Oculus even though other prominent members have gone public supporting Luckey.

-He's just a boy!

Another round of this shit again? The guy has literally done nothing to deserve any benefit of doubt, or any reason for anyone to defend him or those who support him. And still, every thread, there will be people falling over themselves to do so.

What's the point of the thread if it's just gonna be a line of people repeating the same things?

Wherever you go you're gonna find people who look askance at firing someone from their job for a legal political donation. That's why in many states, including California, it's illegal to discriminate against or fire employees for their political views. Yes, Palmer has $900million and it wouldn't hurt him to leave oculus, but people get worried the principle might start migrating down and normal employees might be subject to the same discrimination.

 

[Nzyme32]

Again, How do you know if they simply cannot do anything about it?

Have you seen what they've said? Silence would be one thing but this:



And this



Is not nothing

Pretty much as above. No one is expecting to hear from every single employee or expects the company to let them speak freely on the topic, and as such there is justifiable reason for people to see it as a company wide issue till there is something far more meaningful than the above, especially in light of what is actually known. The approach demonstrated in the OP just adds to all of this. It's contemptuous

 

[Tranqueris]

He's 24 years old, well past the age of majority. Yet another example when adult white males are referred to as kids to minimize their wrongdoings, well done.

He was the major figure behind Oculus. He benefits financially from the work of their employees, both pre- and post-buyout.

Nimble America is cut whole cloth from Milo Yiannopoulos. You may know him from heavily promoting Gamergate, whipping up a racist mob against Leslie Jones for the crime of being black and in a movie, and other such nonsense. So either you didn't know all of this and are commenting on something you know nothing about, or you did know, and just don't care.

But he's just an innocent little kid, who also just happens to follow a rape apologist on Twitter and has a GamerGate supporting bigot of a girlfriend. Notice the pattern here?

 

[SmiteOfHand]

Wherever you go you're gonna find people who look askance at firing someone from their job for a legal political donation. That's why in many states, including California, it's illegal to discriminate against or fire employees for their political views. Yes, Palmer has $900million and it wouldn't hurt him to leave oculus, but people get worried the principle might start migrating down and normal employees might be subject to the same discrimination.

You're right. It would be a terrible precedent to fire someone for "legal political donations."

Good thing that isn't what this is about no matter how many people like yourself come around and try to suggest it.

 

[SmoothRunningGun]

Thread title change is glorious.

 

[Gaogaogao]

pretty scummy behavior across the board

 

[Flai]

-There are good people at Oculus even though other prominent members have gone public supporting Luckey.

Have they really publicly supported Luckey? Just because they haven't publicly condemned him doesn't mean that they support him.

 

[SmiteOfHand]

Have they really publicly supported Luckey? Just because they haven't publicly condemned him doesn't mean that they support him.

The post immediately following mine has their statements.

 

[zoku88]

People in their early 20s are commonly referred to as kids. That's true regardless of whether you're a white or a male.

Someone clearly doesn't know how black males are "aged up".

 

[Seth Enosh]

You're right. It would be a terrible precedent to fire someone for "legal political donations."

Good thing that isn't what this is about no matter how many people like yourself come around and try to suggest it.

So you're mad at something other than the $10k to Nimble America, a legal donation to a legal political organization created to promote Trump, a major political party's presidential candidate? Yes, Trump is terrible and is promoting awful views, but that doesn't make his donation illegal.

What are you saying he should be fired for then?

 

[Tain]

If these people were "bad asses", they would speak up against Luckey or leave the company instead of being associated with a racist who empowers racist causes with his Oculus money and also happens to be the public face of the company – a person that represents these "bad asses" to the public.

Expecting someone to drop their livelihood and potentially the way they provide for their families due to this is absurd tbh

 

[Flai]

The post immediately following mine has their statements.

Fair enough, although I don't see how those make Iribe and Rubin not "good people". It's not like they have given any indication that they share the same views with Luckey or anything.


Can somebody also explain to me that what is the problem with Nimble America? Sure, it sounds like a shitty organization but from what I understand the only thing they have done is a single billboard with a photo of Clinton and text "Too big to jail". And, I mean, that's not in a very good taste but hardly seems like a big deal. The post that Luckey posted as NimbleRichMan to reddit also doesn't seem to be overly controversial either, just a typical pro-Trump, anti-Hillary supporter that you see everywhere. No racist remarks or anything. Am I missing something or why exactly are people so disgusted with Luckey?

 

[Dreamwriter]

They've already missed the boat on this one, a "diversity luncheon" isn't going to obscure the fact that Luckey is a piece of racist garbage and that Facebook and Oculus will continue to support him.

He's racist himself now? What racist action or statement has he done/made?

Can somebody also explain to me that what is the problem with Nimble America?

What people think is the problem is they assume that since one of the main guys involved is a horrible person (Milo Yiannopoulos), then the entire organization must be horrible, and anybody who associates with it in any way must be fully aware of all this and thus be horrible as well.

 

[jax]

If Facebook wants to make money from Oculus, they should open the service, and allow Vive owners to buy the Oculus Touch. It's a fantastic controller! I would buy sensors and everything for it.

I don't think many people are going to choose Oculus over Vive now with all of the negative PR, so they might as well bite the bullet and open their platforms a little bit. It sucks, cause the Oculus headset is pretty cool.

I can't even wear my Oculus shirt anymore without feeling like a massive tool

 

[Insane Metal]

CEO needs mom

LOL lost my shit with this quote

 

[Codeblue]

Fair enough, although I don't see how those make Iribe and Rubin not "good people". It's not like they have given any indication that they share the same views with Luckey or anything.


Can somebody also explain to me that what is the problem with Nimble America? Sure, it sounds like a shitty organization but from what I understand the only thing they have done is a single billboard with a photo of Clinton and text "Too big to jail". And, I mean, that's not in a very good taste but hardly seems like a big deal. The post that Luckey posted as NimbleRichMan to reddit also doesn't seem to be overly controversial either, just a typical pro-Trump, anti-Hillary supporter that you see everywhere. No racist remarks or anything. Am I missing something or why exactly are people so disgusted with Luckey?

Good people don't turn a blind eye to evidence to take someone's word that he didn't do the reprehensible thing we know he did.

Nimble America is a pro-Trump campaign born from a racist subreddit. Therefore it is necessarily a nativist, xenophobic, misogynistic campaign. That's why people are disgusted with him.

 

[PlumCantaloupe]

I hope we can keep these ideas alive. It seems they are counting on our apathy to let this just disappear.

 

[Krejlooc]

What people think is the problem is they assume that since one of the main guys involved is a horrible person (Milo Yiannopoulos), then the entire organization must be horrible, and anybody who associates with it in any way must be fully aware of all this and thus be horrible as well.

Yeah dudes, it's just like how donating to the KKK doesn't make you racist.

durrr....

 

[DontBeThatGuy]

Carmack has a PR handler now?

that's not surprising considering what he's said before

Libertarian, right?

 

[eyeball_kid]

Expecting someone to drop their livelihood and potentially the way they provide for their families due to this is absurd tbh

If they're such "badasses", they won't have any trouble finding another tech job.

The livelihood and family line has been trotted out time and again to excuse looking the other way. Anyone continuing to work at a company who, through silence, endorses Luckey's actions gets no pass from me.

 

[MUnited83]

He's racist himself now? What racist action or statement has he done/made?


What people think is the problem is they assume that since one of the main guys involved is a horrible person (Milo Yiannopoulos), then the entire organization must be horrible, and anybody who associates with it in any way must be fully aware of all this and thus be horrible as well.

One would have to be severely brain damaged to not know what kind of organization Nimble America is and donate 10 thousand dollars to it.


And yes, it's fair to think that the people associated with with are horrible, just like it's fair to think members of the KKK are horrible.

 

[Shaanyboi]

Yup... fuck Oculus.

 

[Usobuko]

Fuck Palmer Luckey and Facebook incompetence in dealing with this.

At this point, you just have to take the whole organization as at least an enabler of the alt right whose founder like Zuckerberg pretends to be a decent fucking human being.

 

[snickothemule]

lol just quit your job if your boss is a dick head.

 

[Doctor Ironic]

What people think is the problem is they assume that since one of the main guys involved is a horrible person (Milo Yiannopoulos), then the entire organization must be horrible, and anybody who associates with it in any way must be fully aware of all this and thus be horrible as well.

Milo Yiannaopoulos isn't the kind of guy you work with despite his political views. His political views ARE his work. If you agree to work with Milo, especially on a SuperPAC designed to support a candidate for president of the United States of America. there's no way in hell you can claim the organization is "apolitical," Aweful Dreamzle.

 

[bigboss370]

one wrong social media post and anyone can get fired from their job, because whether they like it or not they represent the company they work for. unbelievable that facebook isn't willing to cut him