Frozenprince
Banned
Pretty sure Europe had all of those things though.
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Why does this keep happening? Student posts in Blackface on social media
- Thread starter Slayven
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Pretty sure Europe had all of those things though.
Audioboxer
Member
Just for what it is worth I done a recreation of the nativity scene at my primary school and zero people were painted any colour. Heck if I go digging in parents loft I think I could still find the VHS tape recordings they took of me *shudder* I played Joseph \m/ Mah boi big Joe.
At that young an age usually the point is children get on with children and do not care about skin colour. It's literally not something they process and think about in any complex way. Therefore teachers/guardians should not be fucking painting any faces to race switch during a fucking kids play.
The difference with kids is not being fully developed in the brain, hence why we hold parents responsible for certain things kids may or may not get mixed up in. Obviously a girl at Uni is not a kid (I know you know that).
EdibleKnife
Member
Europe indeed did participate in the slave trade and racism. Not sure why they're so quick to forget it.
But but...you are not paying attention to the perceived social intricacies to race issues that I'm just automatically assuming this person exhibits in their day to day life, which totally makes black face not that heinous and probably just for funsies! It's ok guys, she didn't mean it, I know her personally.
Sora the Cat
Member
It can be, sometimes, a sign that that person isn't the only one to blame.
Agreed.
There is, perhaps, the need to be aware that he is being racist. If education or parents failed him, we should try to make that person aware of what his conduct means and then, if it keeps going, we can accuse him of being a full on racist.
LostCaress
Member
Yes, but probably most countries don't have the historically racist blackface context.
Frozenprince
Banned
Well, no, because Europe had minstrel shows just like America did so I'm not sure why people forget that considering that's where modern blackface came from (they were especially popular in England and France).
And, even if they didn't, that's meaningless. Because it's still really fucking racist to do blackface.
Just like it'd be really fucking racist to tape your eyes back and make Asian jokes.
What are you talking about?! These things did not happen in Europe?
WhiskerFrisker
Member
Yeah, I think what she said is stupid but I don't think she should be expelled. You can potentially fuck up her life for a silly post.
Messofanego
Banned
Europe is racism-free now. FIFA ended racism. Where have you been?!
Principate
Saint Titanfall
Full on racist, the fuck, you don't just become a full on racist, it's not a job, people either have racist ideologies thoughts or concepts or they don't, some more severe than others, but those actions and thoughts still remain racist. You can learn from and improve from shitty opinons everyone does that all the time, likely through their life as they learn more about the world, that doesn't absolve you from the shitty thing you've done.
Racists get shunned the degree that they are for a reason, it serves as example to disuade shitty from from the massive flood of shitty behaviour that exits. The point is to not normalise it because fact of the matter is your generally better off as a raging racist than as an oppressed minority. That's why a lot of people don't have to time to for the usual slap on the wrists for events such as this.
1.21Gigawatts
Banned
Sure, but 4 years old don't know about it because they are not confronted with it anymore.
I think there is a misunderstanding going on. Kids aren't told to paint their faces black, at least not usually.
I remember at my kindergarden we had a black kid and they guy never wanted to play the black king because one of the other kings had a sword and he wanted to be the one with the sword. So he painted his face white and a white kid painted his face black.
The only thing going on here was kids who wanted to recreate the look of three people they saw in a book.
And even without the knowledge about the historical context of blackfacing and without the knowledge about racism based on skin color, they usually decide that skin color is such an important visual attibute that they have to recreate it.
I don't even remember this situation myself, but I have pictures of it, but I can imagine that it would have been pretty fucking hard for our kindergarden teacher to explain why our friend is allowed to paint his face white while our other friend is not allowed to paint his face black. And even susggesting that no one would get paint on their faces wouldn't fly with kindergarden kids.
See, kids don't see the implications of it. For them its like saying "You might not be green, but you can still be the Hulk."
I don't see these cultural things changing anytime soon in Europe...
Heck, I'm happy when they don't sing "10 little ni**ers" in kindergarden anymore.
But europes racism is off topic I guess. Lets focus on this girls snap again.
Frozenprince
Banned
There ain't no grand scale of racism that ends with cross burnings and lynchings.
Either something you do is racist and thus, you harbor some racist feelings, or it isn't. There are no "degrees" of racism.
Either something you do is racist and thus, you harbor some racist feelings, or it isn't. There are no "degrees" of racism.
Sure, the KKK Grand Wizard, Trump and this girl all harbor the same hatred towards minorities.
1.21Gigawatts
Banned
See thats not the case in my opinion. Doing something racist doesn't mean that the person also harbors some racist feelings. Sometimes the people just don't know about what they are doing and it just proves their ignorance, but not their racism.
Confronted with what, racism?
Are you really trying to claim that racism isn't a thing in Europe? If so, that is by far the most idiotic thing posted in this thread... that includes the posts from the alt that was deleted.
Sora the Cat
Member
You are missing the point. People grow some way because of the ambient and stimulations that they had through there life. You need to fix the problem on both ends, if you only fix the racist, but put no blame on the system that made them that way, they will just keep coming.
Not necessarily.
Its her on undoing time and time again people get expelled for this stuff yet people keep doing it.
Is she going to lynch somebody, probably not. But that shit all comes from the same place, a view that black people aren't worthy of being seen as human
1.21Gigawatts
Banned
Yes I would say that kindergarden kids in Germany and the Netherlands usually have not experienced any racism, at least non they are aware of.
I don't know how that is in the US since racism in the US is focussed on looks a lot(white, black, hispanic, asian) while the groups suffering from racism the most in europe aren't always easily detected based on their looks(Poles, Turks etc.), but i figure for kindergarden kids to have experienced racism they must have been attacked based on their looks alone.
Frozenprince
Banned
Prejudice on any level is not some acceptable answer. Just because she's not gonna don a bedsheet and start marching against "darkies" while burning a cross doesn't separate her or the prejudice she holds from being just as vile.
Racism is insidious because of exactly that. People are so afraid to confront those smaller examples and deal with them because of this thought.
They all come from the same place.
Principate
Saint Titanfall
You can't use the upbring and narrow experiences for anyone that grows up in this day and age, information is abound and freely available (though as always people believe what they choose to believe).The era of a childs perspective being completely narrowed off are rare as your immediate surroundings forming your view points are becoming less and less of a thing. You do not fix racism, it's not a disease but a persons view point of the world around them. They are not easily altered and never have been at some point a person becomes culpable for their own opinions.
Besides if you think someones opinion of race can be changed so easily do you not think they would come to those realisations on their own without being coddled. The types of people that cause the most damage in a system are the types of people least likely to change their minds. Do you honestly think anyone voting for Donald Trump can be educated on the problems of race to the degree that they wouldn't vote for a white superamcist unless they only marginally supported him in the first place.
Ignoring that if your spending all that time coddling racists what are you doing about the people these racists are opressing in the first place.
The press can never be wrong!
Principate
Saint Titanfall
You think in these multi cultural western societies racism amongst kids isn't rife? What on Earth are you on. Any minority at all, can tell you about the types of bullshit you come across in any western country including those ones. Do you think the prejudice against the refugee's just doesn't exist and isn't rife in German schoolyards against people of colour. Or any other race that sticks out just enough to be noticed. I seriously wonder when people make these statements that they themselves are even aware of the racism and xenophobia around or even whether they're aware have suffient knowledge of th country they reside in that they honestly people kids in Germany have not experienced racism in comparison to anywhere else in the world.
Massive Duck. C.M.
Banned
It keeps happening because people keep defending it and saying "kids will be kids."
By the time you're a high school/college student you should have some fucking sense. The rest of us don't get a complexion pass
By the time you're a high school/college student you should have some fucking sense. The rest of us don't get a complexion pass
Sora the Cat
Member
What you choose to believe from that information is determined, again, from the way you were raised in the first place, from my point of view, more information can't change this fact. I think the ability those people have to determine right from wrong is directly influence by there very own perspective of reality, that can be indeed, changed.
I didn't mean "fix" in that way, english isn't my native language. I meant it as in targeting them and forgetting why they arrived at that point in the first place.
Principate
Saint Titanfall
It's not determined it's influenced by that's not the same thing at all, it's why you have children grow up to hate their parents and everything they stand for or atheists coming frm christian backgrounds because just being fed behaviour doesn't automatically control how you react. This is ignoring that most kids these days spend most of the their time, speaking with friends watching tv and on the internet than they are talking with their parents. So even if they were being molded purely by their environment with no say that environment will never be a completly racist one unless they choose it to be so.
The fact we're even having this arguement is because racism s demonised by society regardless of how hypocritical it is. The chance of someone even coming from an environment without being challenge by the general assumption that racism is bad rare in the first place. They'll either ignore it as society being wrong or due to external or otherwise influences or they'll do mental gymnastics about how what they're doing isn't racist. How likely do you think it is to convince a person doing either of these things.
Irishmantis
Member
Always Sunny be the only guys to get away with Blackface
And that was done purely in the service of "look at how fucking horrible and stupid these characters are".
Frozenprince
Banned
Yeah the whole point of that show is that these are horrible, horrible people.
Snowman Prophet of Doom
Member
Do you genuinely believe that this is how she perceives black people?
I cannot fathom coming to that conclusion based on making a Snapchat joke that the charcoal face mask you put on kinda looks like blackface, but not actually doing any of the things typically associated with what makes blackface so heinous (i.e. doing a caricatured imitations of black speech patterns and behavior to demean and dehumanize for non-blacks' amusement). That she was insensitive to the sensibilities of at least one individual she sent the Snap to is evident, but beyond that, inferring more generalized attitude toward black folk seems wholly unjustifiable to me.
1.21Gigawatts
Banned
I'm part of a minority myself in Germany and I've talked about this issue with lots of other people. Nobody recalled racist events from Kindergarden time. I also asked my parents and they said that among the kids everything was fine before primary school.
Kids aren't born racists and it takes some time to indoctrinate the racism into them.
So I stand by my statement that 4 year olds in Germany and the Netherlands usually have not experienced any racism and therefor don't know about it.
Frozenprince
Banned
Missing. The point. Again.
Racism does not have to be about hatred.
Racism is about prejudice and unfounded views of reality based on that prejudice. Whether she's cognizant of that prejudice or not is, again, irrelevant.
Not okay:
Garnet's skin isn't even that color, wtf lol
Always Sunny hopefully didn't create that trend. :x Love that show besides the scenes where they put blackface on someone.
I tend to agree. Still dislike it though. Especially that scene where Dee goes on a stage poorly imitating her idea of a black woman and speaking to the workers. Ballsy comedy, and I cringed a lot at that. The payoff when they get what they deserve usually makes up for it though.
Messofanego
Banned
WTF
You really think minorities as kids in European countries don't experience racism. Oh man.
Also to your previous posts about racist blackface traditions in European countries, there is plenty of flack that they've gotten, so no they're not accepted widely.
http://www.black-face.com/blackface-world.htm
Zwarte Piet
Netherlands -- St Nicholas Day is celebrated in the Netherlands on December 5, with the arrival of Santa Claus (Sinterklaas), and his helper 'Zwarte Piet' or Black Pete. Together with Sinterklaas, Zwarte Piet helps deliver holiday gifts and sweets to those children who have been good. If you've been bad, the legend says that Black Pete will kidnap you in his sack and take you back to Spain. The Zwarte Piet character made his debut as an African servant in an 1850 book and is an important part of most public Christmas celebrations in the Netherlands.
Balthazar
Spain -- Traditionally the three Wise Men or the Three Kings gave out gifts on January 6. Spaniards paint their faces black in order to realistically portray Balthazar in parades and in church festivals. The Pan African Center, based in Madrid, has just launched a unique campaign to end the practice of having white men paint their faces black ("in a ridiculous and unnecessary parody") and instead have actual black men portray Balthazar.
Germany -- In Germany it is common practice for black roles to be portrayed by whites in blackface. American playwright Bruce Norris wrote a letter to the American Dramatists Guild after canceling German rights to his play Clybourne Park because the producers intended to cast white actors and put them in blackface. Norris wrote, "...blackface has been and continues to be a widespread practice on the German stage. German actors of African descent are routinely passed over for roles explicitly designated for them in some of the largest theatres in the country. This is weakly defended as either a directors prerogative or a matter of artistic choice and yet, when questioned, no one could offer me an equivalent example of a white German actor having lost a role to a black actor in whiteface."
Three Wise Men
Germany - Austria -- Children in Germany and Austria go door to door pretending to be the Wise Men celebrating the birth of Jesus. They sing and ask for donations for charity while wearing costumes. One child wears blackface because it is believed that one of the wise men was from Africa.
Blackface for UNICEF
Germany -- In 2007, advertising agency Jung von Matt/Alster did a pro bono ad campaign for UNICEF Germany about the education crisis in Africa. The campaign used white kids in blackface to represent uneducated Africans. UNICEF dropped the campaign after they received numerous complaints and condemnation.
It keeps happening because black people are still regarded as subhuman. They are to be mocked, laughed at. Shot in the streets. This had been going on for centuries and is deeply incorporated into the national psyche.
Putting on blackface is like putting on clown makeup. You're becoming the buffoon. You welcome mockery and derision. You are demonstrating to others how you feel people of color should be treated. All for entertainment purposes.
You have complete ownership of that dark complexion though. You are able to take it off in an instant. dictate when the farce ends. It's about exercising power, flexing your privileged muscles. Look at me I'm black, isn't that funny? Ok, jokes over, back to my privileged life.
Hope she is expelled.
Putting on blackface is like putting on clown makeup. You're becoming the buffoon. You welcome mockery and derision. You are demonstrating to others how you feel people of color should be treated. All for entertainment purposes.
You have complete ownership of that dark complexion though. You are able to take it off in an instant. dictate when the farce ends. It's about exercising power, flexing your privileged muscles. Look at me I'm black, isn't that funny? Ok, jokes over, back to my privileged life.
Hope she is expelled.
Principate
Saint Titanfall
How much do you think most people even remember of Kindergaten. And how much would your parents who weren't even their know. The racist attitudes that start pop up from middle to highschool don't appear from nowhere (unless your going to tell me they don't exist their either).
Histroric Black College and University. She thought it was funny to joke on not only her classmates but her school and it's history. You can jump to hoops to give her a pass on being racist, doesn't mean everyone else has to.
Do you not understand the difference between making fun of racism and actual racism?
Massive Duck. C.M.
Banned
I though we weren't supposed to coddle college students anymore
Frozenprince
Banned
Yep, LIS the caption removes her benefit of the doubt. She's using blackface to try and make a joke aimed at her school being primarily black. That's prejudice. That's racism.
WhiskerFrisker
Member
I read that as her trying fit in actually.
you know that only works one way
In what universe? Cause black people love to be reminded of shucking and jiving
Messofanego
Banned
Her response to being enrolled at a university that happens to have a sizeable portion of people being black is to put blackface on as a way to fit in like some sort of camouflage. As if black skin colour is a costume. Other students haven't done it, otherwise the news report wouldn't focus on her. She did a racist thing. Whether she hates black people day in day out every single waking moment of her life or not, she's still showing disrespect. She's on the spectrum of racial insensitivity/racism. She's old enough to understand the implications and history of blackface.
If some dude put on a white robe, red headband, and a fake bomb vest onto himself, he'd be considered a racist. He didn't engage in stereotypical Arabic speech patterns, yell allahu akbar, but appearance can be enough to deem you a racist.
Same goes for whiteface.
Come on.
No I dont think so,but it was posted in this topic atleast.
WhiskerFrisker
Member
I thought she was trying to say that she wanted to fit in but she used blackface in a terrible attempt to be funny. It reminded me of this vine I saw on Instagram and I guess people thought it would be funny to try and do the same thing.
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